From volunteering for the NHS to post-lockdown plans and more general experiences of the U.K., Giulia and Mahmoud discuss everything on a typical lockdown zoom call.
This interview is part of our ‘Covid-19 and Migration’ series which focuses on personal reflections and migration-related issues from the pandemic. It series aims to raise awareness of topics and experiences that may not have been at the forefront of the conversation during this time.
In this piece Giulia Mazzu (G) is talking to her friend and colleague Mahmoud Juma (M) about his experiences during this pandemic. Giulia and Mahmoud met and now work together at Our Second Home, a charity which provides youth-led residentials and leadership training for refugees and asylum seekers in the U.K..
Other charities referenced in this interview: Breadwinners is a London-based charity which supports refugees and young people into employment through artisan baked bread. Dost Centre (Centre for Young Refugees and Migrants) is a community centre in Plaistow, London which provides sports activities, English lessons, homework clubs and weekend activities.
G: Please introduce yourself and how long you have been in the U.K..
M: My name is Mahmoud Juma, I came from Sudan in 2018 June or July. Now about 2 years in England.
G: What do you do for work or studying before the lockdown?
M: Before lockdown I studied, I am going to college and I do some work with Breadwinners every Sunday- I work as a stall manager, like charity work with refugees.
G: What are you studying at college? How is college?
M: I study ESOL English, Maths, and some I.T.. College is good, I have got friends, lots of people around me so I like college yeah.
G: Tell me about your work with Breadwinners? What do you do?
M: Breadwinners is a charity organization through training and education. When you start, you do some training about how to sell things, they try to teach us some English, how to be confident, like to be a stall manager in a market. I did the programme for 2 months and then after some time they employed me in a market selling bread to customers. Every Sunday for 7 hours once a week, before Covid-19. During Covid we started to sell bread online, we had training on how to call and sell people bread. Now we call customers every Saturday for 3 hours.
G: How do you find that?
M: It is very difficult for me. I don’t know how to speak English properly- no language and confidence. You call someone and you are trying to talk to them and you don’t know them, it is very difficult for me.
G: Can you tell me more about the training at Breadwinners?
M: With Breadwinners, when you start they have mentoring as well. Before breadwinners I did not have any friends, did not know a lot about the new country and I didn’t know a lot of things. In Breadwinners, you get to know more people and trained to be more confident.
The mentorship programme- I have a mentor, I call her if I have any problems. Like she is like my sister, she calls me and asks me how I am. This is the best part of breadwinners, the mentorship makes us like a real family. I contacted my mentor, her name is Polly, and for about one year I still contact her. She asks me how I feel, what’s happened, what I want for my future and we start planning for my future. A lot of things she is helping me with.
G: When you first arrived in the U.K., how did you find it?
M: It was so difficult for me really, everything was new for me. I did not go out at all, I stayed in my room. If I go out, I don’t know how to speak any English, just “Okay, hi, yes”. Also I was not comfortable. I stayed in my room going nowhere, a lot of distress.
G: When you arrived there was not much support for you then?
M: Yeah, not for me. I stayed at home going nowhere. Marian (from Dost centre) she texted me, I don’t know how she found me, (she said) “There is camping with OSH (Our Second Home)”. She asked me if I am happy to go out for 5 days. To be honest, I did not want to go out to meet people but at that time I was in foster care. I went there and I found everything was very good, the best five days.
G: So this was your first time going to OSH?
M: The first time I went out, I went to OSH. September 2018 as a participant.
G: Through these people like OSH and Dost centre this is how you met people and found your community?
M: Yes, that is the way I found people. I thought okay, everything is normal. Like OSH is the best thing that happened to me.
G: I’m so glad to hear that because I loved OSH when I first went. I have been working with them since August. The first camp I went to was the winter camp where we met and I had so much fun. So tell me about OSH and what you do there?
M: I swear like the first thing you feel is you are family there. There are lots of people there who are nice, they do everything to make you feel comfortable and happy and like to make friends. (There is) every kind of activity, football, climbing, dance. A lot of countries I had no idea existed before this, I met people from those countries.
G: You’re now a leader with OSH, what does that mean?
M: Next training I will lead training on how to be a leader. I will run the activities in camp.
G: How has the lockdown affected your life, your studying, working?
M: When Covid started I was worried. I had been going out a lot. When I started just staying home I found it a bit strange and a bit difficult, you don’t know how long you stay at home. Again, I had a lot of stress and worries about things. Then I found one of my friends texted me and told me people have been cooking for the NHS. I did that volunteering for 2 months, we cooked for the NHS two days a week. I did one day training with Breadwinners and one day of work.
G: How did you find cooking?
M: We cooked 150-200 meals everyday and they sent us nice messages. I really enjoyed it, we laughed, we chatted. (It was) better than staying at home- so boring here.
G: Did you think your migration status affected your lockdown experience?
M: I got 5 years to stay in the U.K.. I have refugee status before Covid-19. Before I got status I worried everyday, I didn’t know if I could stay here or not. Yeah it is very different.
I heard some people in Dost (centre) or OSH that if you don’t have status you are not able to do anything in this country, you are still illegal. So I was worried, I didn’t know about my future, I need to study. I don’t know what I will do if I stay here or in another place. But after status, I am here for 5 years, I can start planning for my future. I am living much more comfortably.
G: Since Covid started we have been thanking all the key workers and a lot of those people are immigrants. We have been talking a lot about how immigrants have been helping keep us together. Do you think the perception of migrants has changed?
M: I see sometimes in images of the NHS and also of London and England they show there is a lot of diversity and nationalities here. I think that people feel that maybe it has changed. Yeah, a lot of people have come together from different countries and nationalities in the NHS.
G: In lockdown you have been working for breadwinners over the phone. We don’t know when lockdown will end but what are your immediate plans? What are you going to do when lockdown ends?
M: After lockdown ends, I don’t know really. College will open back in September, I don’t know when the lockdown will end so I have no idea. But I have become more lazy in lockdown.
G: Everyone has! Have you been going outside to exercise?
M: Yeah I run sometimes, like two days a week.
G: That’s good. So where do you see yourself in the future? What are your plans? What would you like to do?
M: I try to keep it steady, to go to university and maybe graduate. I want to study I.T. or something like that, I find that interesting and something I like. Dream job, maybe in business, running a small business. I am not sure yet. My immediate goal is going to university and working online in sales and marketing.
Special thanks to Mahmoud Juma and Giulia Mazzu.
For information on: Our Second Home, Dost Centre and Breadwinners.
Migration Research Group 